Attitudes of young Czechs towards inter-racial dating

Discussion in 'Culture' started by Speed, Apr 15, 2004.

  1. hockeygirl_leafs07

    hockeygirl_leafs07 Active Member

    The study is by UCLA professor Jay Phelan: ... tyKey=3446

    There was a better scientific explaination of this phenomena but I can't find that article now. I know studies of "races" are controversial but whether or not you believe it, when I see when I see a "mixed-race" child/person, I see a very attractive person. I think that they are generally gorgeous and have a unique blend of features. It's my belief and I do know others who've made similar comments, but you seem to have a lot of bitter resentment towards that. point is, is that you asked about thinking of the children of such marriages. Some of my relatives are "mixed", and besides being physically beautiful, they are happy, normal people. No big problems......
    I was just giving them compliments. I don't think they're wrong. Just a compliment.
    I always tell my friend Lenka that Czech girls are beautiful, that's why a lot of guys go on this website asking to meet Czech girls every week, right?'s okay if people say Czechs are beautiful but if I say biracial children are beautiful then I'm wrong?

    And what's the deal with all the proverbs?
    If you prefer not to date outside your race, that's fine. Most people are just like that. It is true people tend to date people who look similar to them That does not make you racist, but your comment about the Roma......
  2. Eva2

    Eva2 Well-Known Member

    With the world becoming a global village, the mixing of races is inevitable. A hundred years from now it will be quite normal, whether you like it or not. Gosh, will this debate ever end?
  3. Bohaemus

    Bohaemus Well-Known Member

    Hockeygirl, thanks for the link! I never believed that it would be possible in the politically correct U.S.A.! :?

    Now I know that I am asymmetrical and have lost the genetic lottery :cry:.

    Jay Phelan and Nancy Etcoff have no cogent arguments (hungry bees prefer more symmetrical flowers :eek: ) and their studies are goofy. They must win an anti-Nobel price.

    But where will the celebrated diversity (both genetical and cultural) be then?

    What's wrong with the innocent proverbs? They are for relaxation only.

    Každá liška chválí svůj vlastní ocas.
    Every fox praises its own tail.
  4. hockeygirl_leafs07

    hockeygirl_leafs07 Active Member

    Actually it has been established many MANY times that beautiful people are more symmetrical. Symmetry has a lot to do with beauty--it's pretty much what makes a person beautiful or ugly physically.
    You see nobody is perfectly symmetrical b/c perfection does not exist in nature but some sure look closer to it than others. It isn't obvious that our features are asymmetrical but they actually are. ... ce_gr6.pdf ... irror.html "What is beauty?"
    "One genetic characteristic that symmetry reveals is genetic diversity. Follow this closely: The more heterozygous the individual, the more facial symmetry is observed. The ability to successfully resist or withstand various environmental traumas or parasitic infection. A heterozygous individual has a wider range of genetic potential to resist parasitic invaders--to produce proteins that are unfamiliar to infectious organisms. Pathogens are least resistant to rare alleles."
    Phelan asserts that so-called mixed-race people (who are more heterozygous and have more genetic variety) are more symmetrical than those who weren't mixed.
    Well whether or not you believe there is a science or math behind beauty (I'm not even going to get into Fibonacci's numbers) or that it is in the eye of the beholder, the point is, is that when I see a mixed-race person, more than likely that person is really attractive. I've noticed this long before I've read any study. Here in Canada, I've seen more biracial people than you have, trust me--they are good-looking.
    Even if all these scientific studies are wrong, I still believe that these people are incredibly beautiful and it was never my intention to make anyone feel resentful, insecure or jealous. Simply, there is an advantage to mixing races and it sure is better than inbreeding.
    Secondly, I was paying those people a compliment. Never mind science. It was a COMPLIMENT. Better to call someone beautiful than to say they belong to a parasitic culture.
    Listen, I have a female Czech friends who does not consider herself beautiful, but I always tell her Czech girls are the most beautiful in Europe (even though I seriously can't tell Czech from Ukrainian, French, British, Swedish, Hungarian, etc from looks alone). I'm trying to cheer her up, but I do think they are mostly quite pretty. I think it wouldn't hurt to pay compliments.
  5. Speed

    Speed Member

    Wow! looks like this has become quite a discussion. Before I make my few points, I thank all the people for their passion about this subject.

    1. First, I think you guys( and gals) must give Bohaemus a chance. From what I can see, all that the guy is saying is that biracial children will have a harder time growing up in CZ.

    Obviously, if you are different from most people around you in the way you look, in your religion or in whatever else, I think, you will grow up sooner because you are concious of the fact that you are different. Now, some kids might come out and embrace their uniqueness, and some kids might loath the fact that they are not like everyone else, and there will be whole bunch of kids somewhere in between.

    2. I dont think we are going to change each other's minds by one-uping the other person...perhaps, we will have a better chance trying to understand opposing viewpoints without the accustations. So, please guys, lets not call eaach other's names.
    To Bohaemus

    3. If people see a interacial couple on the street in CZ, I dont think they think of how hard it will be for their biracial children! Most of them would probably react more instinctively either favourably or unfavourably. So, I think it is much more insightful to ask why some people loath the idea of a interracial couple almost instinctively? So, Bohaemus I would appreciate if you can give any insights into why you think some people react that way. Meaning, is the fact that they will have biracial children who will have hard childhoods, the only thing that bothers you ?

    4. And Bohaemus, say if you fall head over heels with some black girl from say Namibia, would you not pursue that relationship because you think it will suck for your children ? Also, do you think you will ever enertain the thought of dating a person from a different race in your mind ? What if your biracial children will grow up in say hypothetically speaking, a biraicial heaven?

    Since my questions are honest, I would appreaciate if you make honest, and thoughtful remarks.
  6. Karel

    Karel Well-Known Member

    If someone says that some ethnic group is parasitic it borders on racism. Bohaemus gives people the shaft because of their looks, and that`s wrong. I haven`t noticed anyone proclaim that a mixed people`s life is easy in the CR. On the contrary, racism is widespread and something should be done about it at last. Chicago in the 40s is what the current situation is in the CR. Read other posts as well. Whether someone`s bf/gf is from Ukraine, Germany or the UK, Czech parents of the people involved seem to disapprove of it. I don`t think it would be an issue at all to marry a person from the UK provided s/he is white, but others would have a trying time. There`s also a big difference in people`s perception between a Vietnamese/Chinese and Japanese. Sometimes it`s not the looks but the culture which comes along with it. (I could write stacks on this)


    Stranger:"Why do you think that the United States is better than Japan?"
    Karel:"Because you`re given the possibility to go your own way in life"

    The Japanese government has just passed a law saying that in the event of a natural disaster like an earthquake or an act of terrorism, the government has said it will protect Japanese "kokumin" which means Japanese nationals. What the law pointedly excludes is non-Japanese citizens and foreigners living in Japan, and that police etc. can legally discriminate against non-Japanese in the event of a disaster.

    Hope this bursts your idyllic bubble about Japan
  7. S2kDriver

    S2kDriver Well-Known Member

    Bringing this thread back up from the dead .....

    I'm Korean and my sweetie pie (the angry lady :wink:) is Czech living near Brno. We've been together for more than 2 years and we're none the worse for wear *knock on wood* :) We plan on getting hitched in a couple of years. Aside from being such a cutie, she's the most amazing girl I've ever met all around and I don't know if I'll find another like her. Whenever I visit her in and around Blansko, I've never seen another Asian (though I see a plethora of them at the airport in Ruzyné) and I get the occasional looks of intrigue. They are very few and far between in her neck of the woods. Even though not all Czech youths may share her views, she doesn't have any issues with interracial relationships and her parents like me as well. :p

    And to those concerned about racism during visits ..... never during all of my visits have I felt I was being prejudiced against or hated. On the contrary, I get the occasional looks of intrigue (and understandably) and the rest are smiles and welcoming acknowledgements. I've never really felt uncomfortable, aside from my not knowing how to speak Czech (the angry lady is my walking translator).
  8. vonfox

    vonfox New Member

    Sova, I cant belive, what you wrote. I am from Czech republic, but never heard this is normal here to put items to bags in stores, I always pay for my purchase. Its same, if I say about my american friend, he almost got arrested for shooting on the street, because every american has gun and it normal to shoot people in US (of course it is not true)

    [an American friend of mine married a Czech girl and brought her over to the U.S. to live with him. He'd been in the Czech Republic, but she hadn't ever been to the U.S. I heard that on her first solo shopping experience here, she almost got arrested in a grocery store for putting items into her bag inside the store (which of course is perfectly fine in the C.R., but is a no-no here in the U.S.). :oops: Of course, when race differences are involved, add social pressures to the list.[/quote]
  9. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

    You misunderstood, vonfox (you must have missed my post on page 3). What I meant is that it is not uncommon for Czechs to put items into their bags while shopping, i.e. fully intending to pay for them, and doing so. Many Czech grocery stores, particularly the small ones, don't have shopping carts, so either you're forced to carry all the items you intend to buy in your hands, or else you bring in a bag for convenience to carry them while you shop. Then empty the bag at the register to pay as you leave.

    P.S. Please read the whole thread next time!
  10. vonfox

    vonfox New Member

    Sova, I agree with you in your oppinion, that different culture brings some problems and misunderstanding, but I have to tell you, your exam is not right. I don´t mean, this would never happened, but this is not normal and common exam. Let me tell you, I have been to U.S. in total almost one year and I never had any problem with law (and first 3 months I spent in Utah and I thing it s easy to get in trouble there). I mean, I have been there first time too and I (or my friends, not just me) never put items into my bag (and of course it´s not OK to do it here (CR) as well, before you come to register)
  11. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

    Vonfox, I'm just talking from my own experience, of personally watching Czechs (most often old ladies) put items in their bag while shopping, and them emptying the bag at the register to pay. Also, note that this was 11-12 years ago. Perhaps this is not the norm (or even wasn't at the time), but I personally saw it happen hundreds of times and in several cities. Halef, another (Czech) moderator, even commented that he had seen it done often. I don't want to argue the point further, but it seems obvious (to me at least) that some Czechs (including some store owners) are okay with the practice.

    In addition, I wasn't trying to say that this particular cultural faux pas is common, but rather trying to make an example that I thought would be amusing.
  12. magan

    magan Well-Known Member

    Irish don't count Smurf, they look same so there is not "visible" problem.

    I am Canadian, Czech born with many friends in CR and living partially in Prague and number of my Canadian friends are Indian origin.

    You did not elaborate on why are you asking your question. but just short general answer.

    You will have one big disadvantage in CR - public association with Rom people who have terrible reputation there. For that reason:

    1. you will not meet decent girl in a bar or any public places. Only way how to meet girl would be at work or at the University where you will have the opportunity to let them know you first.

    2. people might start clutching their purses on public transportation and would not be friendly towards you thinking that you are "gypsy"(this is true and experienced/done many times - but I can tell the difference)

    3. Her parents will have a huge problem with it for the above reason....they still care very much about "what would people say..." and this would be something they "cannot hide".

    4. You better have high education and are well groomed to overcome any prejudices CR still has about India - they know nothing about.

    Perhaps I was too harsh in my opinion, but you asked. Younger generation has more open mind and between two people who know each other it would be only cultural differences they have to cope with. All other around them - living in CR would not be easy.
  13. MK

    MK Well-Known Member

    Shopping in own bags

    my 2 cents
    I can imagine situation when there are no shopping carts available (only shopping baskets) so I will put larger items into my own bag and leave it near register. Then I will continue shopping using shopping basket only. While at register I will not empty my bag, I will just show what and how much of it is inside.

    When would be shopping carts available then I will put larger things inside my bag and load the bag on shopping cart.

    Inside Czech shops it is absolutely OK to put anything “anywhere” you wish just do not forget to pay at register. Generally: you can not be accused of stealing while in shop. Please do not take me literally. When you are obviously/(or at least suspicious for) thieving then the shop security can act immediately or they will wait for you near register to give you hard time. So shop like you wish but do not forget “they are always watching you”.

    Other example
  14. magan

    magan Well-Known Member

    I have to say to all those who are putting merchandise CR into your bags or packets that one of those days you will get arrested. IT IS NOT ACCEPTABLE in CR or anywhere else!! There are always baskets or shopping cards in grocery stores. There are also store detectives....thanks to you we pay more... so they can watch you and wait till you empty your packets at the cash register.

    If you have every seen little old ladies do so, please realize that they tried.....and then they have change of mind or chickened out or realized that someone was watching them and then took merchandise out for cashier to register.

    Sorry to burst your fantasy of behaviour in CR, but what you are describing is not acceptable. Please do not write this as you will get other visitors to CR into trouble.

    All who are writing this nonsense - who are you? Are you man who goes grocery shopping once in a lifetime? Are you from other planet or are you really Czech citizen knowing what are you talking about?
  15. MK

    MK Well-Known Member

    Huh Magan, I were quite taken aback by your angry reaction. I have no intention to mislead somebody or tell stories.

    Please do not misunderstand me. There is no doubt about the fact that standard “Czech shopping routine” does not differs from that one used in other countries: take a shopping cart, put things in it, empty it at cash register, then load it again and finally unload it into the car. We also do not shop into own bags. On the contrary, if you decide to avoid loading/unloading of some hard-to-handle merchandise by putting its into your bag then you will not encounter any problem by doing so.

    IMHO using own bags has its roots in times when beverages were sold in glass bottles. You usually brought empty bottles in your own bag. After taking change or bill for them you started shopping by putting full bottles into your bag. During the rest of shopping you were using shopping basket but it was also very usual to go back and add some larger or heavier merchandise to your bag.

    The customers are not the reason why store detectives exists, the shoplifters are. They do not intend to bully customers and nobody will wait for you at register if you will act like customer. There is bold line between putting things in bag to shorten time at cash register and putting things in bag to steal them. In any case using own bags while shopping is not common and highly unrecommendable to foreigners.

    Regarding old ladies, I do not believe they tried to start shoplifting career and chickened. I think they just did not want to mess up with that terrible things named shopping cart and shopping basket. I also think they did not emptied their bags while at register but just put it on the counter and let cash register lady do her work.
  16. magan

    magan Well-Known Member

    :roll: Was I loud :roll: I hope we eventually meet in Prague, so you will see I am just nice person who wants to help (and is sometimes "loud"). I wear always big smile :D :D but unfortunately, it is not visible on the screen when I write.

    I wrote in general terms - you were not the only one who thought it was fine to put stuff somewhere else than where it belongs while shopping. I did have visions of all foreigners reading it and getting into trouble while there. 8) ?
  17. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

    Magan, I shopped on at least a weekly basis, and often two to three times a week over the course of two years in the Czech Republic. I never saw anyone put things into their pockets, but did see people using bags all the time (never tried it myself, however, and as you say, I wouldn't recommend the casual tourist doing it either). Many of these "old ladies" I saw doing this were regulars in the store and would do this on a regular basis, and as I mentioned even emptying their bags to pay in front of the cashiers, who never said a word. Hence, I seriously doubt they were shoplifters thinking twice about an opportunity. Perhaps it was just in certain shops, where the cashiers knew their customers (?), but it definitely happened, and even if it wasn't by far the norm, it seemed perfectly acceptable to the store clerks in those circumstances I witnessed. I can't say more, except to apologize if I have generalized something that shouldn't have been.
  18. MK

    MK Well-Known Member

    Magan, no harm taken. No doubt you are nice person. :D


    That “shopping once in a lifetime” it was hard hit. :(

    I do shopping :shock:

    Really :? :?

    Sometimes :oops:

    If time allows ... :oops: :oops:

    But I am present on all important ones. :wink: :p
  19. MK

    MK Well-Known Member

    To Magan and Sova

    I am really sorry.
    I just realized that writing that “Other example” were stupid idea. It was misleading. So I deleted it.

    Shame on me :oops:
  20. magan

    magan Well-Known Member

    I think that we three should shut up and go shopping :twisted: :) so this discussion can go back to original topic.

    There were actually long discussions way back regarding different race and Czechs It could be probably found in archives. it is very easy to be idealistic about it, but I thing that poster was asking how do Czechs look at it in general.

    And I would say - "not good" and it is mainly because Czechs were exposed (from distance!!!) to only one kind of people of different colour in CSSR (Gypsies). They have seen so many documentaries about poor population in far away countries, that they cannot imagine that colour does not make any difference in social status. They have seen few blond girls walking on the street with black African students (on scholarship in Prague before 1968) and coudn't understand it in any other way than "he is foreigner she must be doing it for money". There is still lots of prejudice regarding colour of the skin. I also have to say that I do speak for "older generation of Czechs" as they are most of my friends. It is not thing to talk about though. I am Canadian most of my life. and I can tell from their carefully worded questions about life in Canada, that they would never understand how majority of people in rest of the world feel.

    We can have idealistic speaches about what we would do if we would fall in love, but it is very complicated topic........and we don't even know what brought original poster here to ask.

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