Role of men and women

Discussion in 'Culture' started by lisap, Nov 11, 2007.

  1. dzurisova

    dzurisova Well-Known Member

    No I don’t think it’s disgusting to joke about it and yes I do think Catholicism influenced the governments decision to send bastard children to orphanages and yes some African governments are corrupt and if you are going to move to Czech Republic, you may find the need to lighten up a bit lest you find yourself often offended as you will find that most Czechs have a rather dark humor and often purposely avoid political correctness for the sake of blatant truth.
  2. Petr_B

    Petr_B Well-Known Member

    What kind of world you live in? It's pretty obvious that your religion affects you (and everything and everyone around you), starting with the meals you can and can not eat, through the clothes you're allowed to wear (without risking to be attacked at street by your co-believers, no matter what the law says) or events you must or must not attend to the way you treat other people (whether they are women, believers in another god etc.).

    Currently, like it or not, Islam is the worst among "big" religions when it comes to mainstream intolerance and violence.
    They're no better than e.g. mainstream Christians were just few centuries ago. Fortunately, following the raise in education and living standards in developed countries, the number of religious fanatics decreased here and so did their power. And while there are still Christian fanatics there, their numbers are much lower than of those Islamic ones. What was the last time you saw massive riots because someone in a small country you probably never heard about before dared to publish a caricature of Jesus Christ?

    On the other hand, I heard there are still some places where families not regularly attending Sunday's mass are frown upon.
  3. Ctyri koruny

    Ctyri koruny Well-Known Member

    If you are in a country of mostly atheists do you feel comfortable walking down the street naked?
    If you go to a party where you know everyone will be an atheist, do you take off all your clothes?

    Religion is more about what keeps you going when you are on your own, what does that song say...
    "What do you see when you turn out the light?
    .. I can't tell you but I know it's mine"

    The things that govern a society are laws and cultural beliefs, some of these were discussed and chosen, some where subconscious, some where passed down for centuries, whether they are written in a book as a "law" or a "religion" or weather they are written in the collective unconscious, they are equally powerful.
    All of these things feed off each other and are born from each other. All of them carry equal weight, but each of them can exist and control without the help of the other two.

    But if you believe there is a god or not, you must believe that all of the rules laid out by a religion of a society were based on the values that already existed before the religion.
    These rules and values started because they were essential for survival, long ago.

    (e.g. It says in the Bible you can not eat shell fish, this is probably because shellfish cause gout, but it is worded something along the lines of "unclean"... Today people don't worry so much about gout, and Christians are almost unaware of this )

    You could say the difference between religion and the other two is that many people feel it can't be changed to meet the changing world.
    But the thing is, it can, each book is so filled with contradictions and metaphors and stories that it can be adapted to prove any point (as we have seen, the negative examples have stood out), so the other two things will eventually bring it forward (or backwards) depending on the needs of the population. It's evolution.

    People will always make their personal decisions and no one is without influence, if they weren't influenced by religion it would be by some equally powerful external force.

    A few century's ago!?
    50 years ago!
    We should hate (some of) them for being 50 years behind?

    Do you really think all Muslims feel like this? It is a tiny tiny minority!

    Surely the organized planed and supported "Christian" invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan has resulted in more deaths than a few (or a couple of hundred thousand, if you watch Fox news) suicide bombings committed by individuals or small rouge organizations

    Do you really think that had anything to do with the religions of any of the nations? Nothing does!

    Massive riots? They were protests. And Christians stage protests of South Park all the time.

    "Frowned upon?"
    Gay people are being beaten up all around the world, if it wasn't gay people it would be some other minority, it always has been, it's human nature, we've always hated people outside of our immediate communities and we always will. I don't blame religion, but it is insane to say that one is worse than another.
    Abortion clinics were being bombed quite frequently in the 90s by Christians (it's extremely difficult to find anything about this online any more) , it was still illegal to be gay in Ireland up until something like 93, divorce was also only legalized here in the 90s.

    It is such a shame, you know there is not a single country in the world where surveys did not find that family was the number one most important thing in peoples lives, so why can't we all understand each other?
  4. kibicz

    kibicz Well-Known Member

  5. Petr_B

    Petr_B Well-Known Member

    Mmm, I must have missed the news about angry Italian Catholic mob supported by (at least some of) their spiritual leaders burning down the US embassy after airing some of the South Park episodes and many important people calling for the boycott of the US products. There goes your Allah caricature analogy.
    By the way, I heard there was an episode of South Park in which they dared to make fun of Scientology/Scientologists and that the Scientologists (almost?) managed to prevent its airing?

    I also don't remember whoever is the closest to the Christian equivalent of Grand Ayatollah and/or a leader of a country calling for a death of a writer. And we could go on and on. Sure, the problems are fanatics (no matter what their "religion" is), but I guess one's faith is so important to believers that they can't leave the people who don't share their beliefs alone. And for several reasons, Islam currently seem to have huge numbers of them.

    I don't know if these muslim extremists are actually just a loud minority. What matters is that the voice of moderates isn't heard, so either they don't exist or they don't dare to speak aloud. And even if the extremists were a minority, they're still very dangerous, it's not just a myth.

    Was the American invasion of Afghanistan and Iraq really a Christian invasion in order to spread Christian religion like you suggest? I don't think so, more pragmatic reasons (like economical) seem to be more likely.

    That's enough talk about religion for me. I believe anything I would have written about the topic has been already written by someone else and written much better than I could ever do it.

    Homosexuality is not loathed only in religious countries, as far as I know, homosexual intercourse was a crime e.g. in USSR too. I guess it's not easy to live with a deviation*, whatever name you give to it. * shrugs *

    * Deviation used in its original sense, as in "deviates from the norm", where norm is being heterosexual (>90% of population).
  6. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    Well, Catholic mobs...

    I remember that mob in North Ireland and that little Protestant girl...
  7. fabik317

    fabik317 Well-Known Member

    It's the same old theme since 1916, in your head, in your head they're still fighting.

    That is not dead which can eternally lie yet in strange aeons even death may die.
  8. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    Yeah, zombies, zombies in our heads. We all have some.

    They will come!!!
  9. Ctyri koruny

    Ctyri koruny Well-Known Member

    Oh how could I have forgotten northern Ireland! Thousands of people killed in the name of Christianity! Men women and children!

    Of course, it had nothing to do with Christianity, just as so called "Islamic violence" has nothing to do with Islam.
  10. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    It has to do with people, who believe in something.
  11. Ctyri koruny

    Ctyri koruny Well-Known Member

    Yes! Exactly! And people will always believe in something, there'll always be reasons to fight!
  12. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    Not all people and not everywhere.
  13. Ctyri koruny

    Ctyri koruny Well-Known Member

    Who doesn't believe in anything? Maybe someone who is clinically depressed...

    I believe in family
    I believe in friendship
    I believe in human rights
    I believe in animal rights
    I believe in preserving the Irish language
    I believe in a minimum wage
    I believe in free health care
    I believe in free education
    I believe in the right to vote
    I believe the function of a state is to provide services and protection for people and to look after the economy as best they can and that they should have as little to do with life beyond that as possible.
    I believe there is nothing unhygienic about wearing shoes in doors.
    I believe that hate consumes people
    I believe that in order to learn a language it is essential to produce. (Use it in an active way rather than repeating what you have learned)
    I believe caterpillars turn into butterflies, but I have never seen it happen.
    I believe in Santa Clause

    Anything that is an opinion is a sort of belief, and violent people can (and often do!) come to blows over it.

    "People come to thinking that they are right, and that being right gives them the right to kill."
    - Albert Camus
  14. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    In Czech you can translate English word believe in more ways.

    věřit - believe in something, without proof
    věřím v Boha - I believe in God.

    myslet - believe like in:
    Myslím, že to dokážu - I believe that I can do it. / I think I can do it.

    Být přesvědčen - believe on basis of arguments or proof
    Jsem přesvědčen, že je to pravda - I believe, it's true. / I'm convinced it's true.
  15. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    Generaly, Czech language is more specific that English, so often things you can say in English with vague term, in Czech you have to specify details. It's sometimes nightmare for translators :)
  16. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

    Yes, we know, eso--we've had this conversation numerous times--but you have to understand that we're speaking in English, and since you know the multiple meaning of the word "believe" in English (at least multiple from the Czech perspective), do we really have to mince words here and play at the same old game? :roll:
  17. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    Well, I believe ;) ctyri koruny doesn't know it.

    I'm sorry I'm annoying, but I believe, that these assertions:

    have in Czech quite different meanings in connection with respective Czech translation. That's all.

    And now i will shut up. :)
  18. Petr_B

    Petr_B Well-Known Member

    Sorry, I couldn't help it. :twisted:

    By the way, Ms. EnglishTeacher, are "Santa Clause" and "in doors" (vs indoors) correct alternate spellings? I'm not trying to nitpick on your spelling, I'm just curious (and improving my poor English is one of the major reasons I'm frequenting this board).
  19. Polednikova

    Polednikova Well-Known Member

    And I would say to Ctyri koruny, I believe in a lot of things, but not enough to fight over! Life's too short.

    And you'd better get over your belief about wearing shoes indoors when you come over here! No-one wears outdoor shoes in the house and you'll be regarded as a rather rude guest if you don't take your shoes off when going into a Czech home... Believe me, you'll just do it. You'd feel very uncomfortable if you didn't. You just make sure you don't go out with holes in your socks!
  20. Ctyri koruny

    Ctyri koruny Well-Known Member

    I never stopped to consider that.


    You are right, with an "e" it is a legal thing, as in the movie: "The Santa Clause" (You put on the suit, you are Santa Claus!).

    And yes! Indoors should be all one word! I am sorry for being such a poor example!
    My spelling really is diabolical, at least those are two mistakes I won't make again.

    What I mean to say is: "I was testing you! You passed!"

    Yes don't worry Polednikova I don't have any problem taking off my shoes, I just don't feel it's a hygiene issue heh.

    Does that translate that if you drop food on the floor, it's ok to pick it up and eat it?
    Because here it isn't.. It's even frowned upon with hard shelled sweets.. but if the sweet is nice enough people will understand and look the other way ;)

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