Pronunciation

Discussion in 'Grammar & Pronunciation' started by scrimshaw, Jul 8, 2008.

  1. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    Words like 'hadr', with the hard 'r' sound at the end.
    That would be considered two syllables...ha-dr, right?
    Then, for the plural....hadry, hadrům, hadrech...would it be three syllables
    ha-dr-ech? or would it then become ha-drech?
     
  2. Karel_lerak

    Karel_lerak Well-Known Member

    ha-dr
    ha-dry
    ha-drech
    ha-drář
    kmo-tr
    kmo-tra
    kmo-tři
     
  3. MichaelM

    MichaelM Well-Known Member

    And, in the same spirit of pronunciation questions, what about the -n 'hacek' as the ending of words like pisen or the town of Trebon? I have listened hard to native speakers including my Czech ucitelka and do not hear the -je sound that I would think should be there given the ending -n 'hacek'. Instead, the sound to my uneducated ears is no different than -n (no hacek).
     
  4. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    I don't know about your question, MichaelM, I hear spoken czech so rarely.
    But, yet another question

    Is there a difference in the way these two words are pronounced?, or is the meaning just figured out by context of the sentence?

    Jeli k obchodu.
    Je-li jít se mnou, má si pošpíchat.
     
  5. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    Maybe not a good example. that would probably be

    Chce-li jít se mnou.

    How about
    Je-li tam sám, bude osamělý.
     
  6. Karel_lerak

    Karel_lerak Well-Known Member

    There is definitely a difference in pronunciation of n and ň
    Compare with similar (or same) spanish ñ in señor, enseñar

    The same sound is in czech words where you do see ..ni.. (pronounced ňi)

    in czech, there is a distinct difference in pronunciation:

    blázen (fool)
    x
    bázeň (awe, fear)

    ohon (tail)
    x
    Třeboň (local name)
     
  7. Karel_lerak

    Karel_lerak Well-Known Member

    the "jeli" and "je-li" is pronounced exactly the same way, the meaning you get by context
     
  8. Qcumber

    Qcumber Well-Known Member

    I suppose there is schwa between the /d/ and the /r/ or the /t/ and the /r/.
     
  9. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    Hey Karle :D
    Co to znamená schwa?
     
  10. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

  11. kibicz

    kibicz Well-Known Member

    This thread lacks one important thing - examples where schwa appears. so even after reading it in past and now again i know almost nothing abous schwa in cz(resp. i still think there is no such thing).
     
  12. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    Well that makes it easier :D .
    If a native czech doesn't even notice such a fine nuance, if it exists at all, then certainly I won't.
     
  13. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

    If you're of my generation, scrimshaw, you'll recognize the schwa sound from Elementary English classes as the upside down "e" [ə] symbol in phonetics. See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schwa.
     
  14. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    I get it. It is the nondistinctive uhhhh sound, that does not fit the sound for any of the used vowels, yet fills a gap.

    I see why they suggest the 'a' in 'about'.
    The sound there neither fits the long 'a' sound as in 'fate', or the short 'a' sound as in 'cat'.

    But still, I'm sure my ears wouldn't notice such a thing.
     
  15. kibicz

    kibicz Well-Known Member

    "V češtině se tento foném nevyskytuje." - glad to read:)
     
  16. Polednikova

    Polednikova Well-Known Member

    I've got it, finally. It's just I didn't know that that sound had a name. I think a good example, for Englísh English speakers at least (ie not Americans) would be how we say 'Yorkshireman'. It's not Yorkshireman, in the same way as we would say man in 'a man from Yorkshire', but a Yorkshirem-schwa-n!
     
  17. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

    Yes, it's been a matter of ongoing debate between the linguists in this forum as to whether or not Czech uses the schwa.
     
  18. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

    Polednikova, I don't recall hearing the word "schwa" in elementary school. I remember we called it something else, but I can't remember exactly what.
     
  19. Karel_lerak

    Karel_lerak Well-Known Member

    At least it can be used explaining the so called syllabic ("slabikotvorné") "R" or "L" 8)

    Vrhl (se z mostu) [Vərhəl] ...
    Prst (finger) = [pərst] and not [prəst] 8)
     
  20. kibicz

    kibicz Well-Known Member

    Yes! This( pərst and Vərhəl )is what you can hear when someone from foreign(esp eng. speaking) country is speaking czech.
     

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