1) Is this correct? vlak = train [masc.] nominative : vlak vlak do Paříže = the train for / to Paris vlak od Paříže = the train from Paris genitive : vlaku nastoupit do vlaku = to get onto the train dative : vlaku pod vlaku = under the train accusative : vlak pro vlak = for the train locative : vlaku ve vlaku = on the train instrumental: vlakem jet vlakem = to take the train 2) In what case is _vlak_ in the following sentence? vystoupit z vlaku = to alight from the train
1) one error pod vlakem (where?) - instr. pod vlak (to where?) - acc. Skočil pod vlak. He jumped (to a place) under the train. Tělo bylo pod vlakem. The cadaver was under the train. 2) genitive
Thank you, Zeisig. This is my post now corrected. vlak = train [masc.] nominative : vlak vlak do Paříže = the train for / to Paris vlak od Paříže = the train from Paris genitive : vlaku nastoupit do vlaku = to get onto the train vystoupit z vlaku = to alight from the train dative : vlaku [any phrase with the dative?] accusative : vlak pro vlak = for the train Skočil pod vlak. = He jumped under the train. locative : vlaku ve vlaku = on the train instrumental: vlakem jet vlakem = to take the train pod vlakem = under the train Tělo bylo nalezeno pod vlakem. = The cadaver was found under the train.
Skočil pod vlak. = He jumped under the train. I am not sure if the above translation is correct. 1) Zajíc běžel pod vlak. (acc.) means The hare ran from A to B. A = a place which is not under the train B = a place which is under the train 2) Zajíc běžel pod vlakem. (instr.) means The hare ran from A to B. both places are under the train Can anybody translate the blue sentences into common English. :?:
Zeisig : I don't think English can express the difference. Both sentences would translate as "The hare ran under the train." and would require further explanations. Something like: 1) The hare ran under the train and hid there. 2) The hare ran the train, between the rails. What do you think of it? 3) There is a third situation: The hare ran across the track under the train to burrow in the field. (Points A and B are on either side of the track.)
This is what I obtain after integrating your data, Zeisig. Thanks a lot. vlak = train [masc.] nominative : vlak vlak do Paříže = the train for / to Paris vlak od Paříže = the train from Paris genitive : vlaku nastoupit do vlaku = to get onto the train vystoupit z vlaku = to alight from the train dative : vlaku Jdu k vlaku do Paříže. = I am going to the train for Paris. accusative : vlak pro vlak = for the train Skočil pod vlak. = He jumped under the train. Zajíc běžel pod vlak. = The hare ran under the train (and hid there). locative : vlaku ve vlaku = on the train instrumental: vlakem jet vlakem = to take the train pod vlakem = under the train Tělo bylo nalezeno pod vlakem. = The cadaver was found under the train. Zajíc běžel pod vlakem. = The hare ran under the train (between the rails).
3) Zajíc proběhl pod vlakem. (instr.) means The hare ran from A to B. - the points A,B are not under the train - the trajectory A-B is partially under the train - the hare ran either between the rails or across the track
Zajíc běžel pod vlak. Zajíc vběhl pod vlak. These sentences have different meanings. In a subordinate clause: Zatímco zajíc běžel pod vlak, ... While the hare was running under the train, ... Když zajíc vběhl pod vlak, ... When the hare has (or had?) run under the train, ... But my knowledge of English is very poor. :cry:
Qcumber's right in that they can't be easily and quickly expressed in English. Something more would have to added to make things perfectly clear. When you say, "The hare ran under the train," most native speakers will assume the hare was not under the train before. Trying to say something like Zeisig's second sentence would be something like "The hare ran around under the train," (running erraticly) "The hare ran along under the train," (more or less linearly) or "The hare ran from point A to point B, while under the train."
Jana's and Zeisig's new data are integrated now. (Thanks ) All this is very exciting. Czech is a treat for linguists. I wish I had studied it when I was young. VLAK = TRAIN [masc.] nominative : vlak vlak do Paříže = the train for / to Paris vlak od Paříže = the train from Paris genitive : vlaku nastoupit do vlaku = to get onto the train vystoupit z vlaku = to alight from the train dative : vlaku Jdu k vlaku do Paříže. = I am going to the train for Paris. accusative : vlak pro vlak = for the train Skočil pod vlak. = He jumped under the train. Zajíc běžel pod vlak. = The hare ran under the train (and hid there). Zatímco zajíc běžel pod vlak, ... = While the hare was running under the train, ... Když zajíc vběhl pod vlak, ... = When the hare has (or had?) run under the train, ... locative : vlaku ve vlaku = on the train instrumental: vlakem jet vlakem = to take the train pod vlakem = under the train Tělo bylo nalezeno pod vlakem. = The cadaver was found under the train. Zajíc běžel pod vlakem. = The hare ran under the train (between the rails). Zajíc proběhl pod vlakem. (instr.) = The hare ran across the track under the train.
A little bit off the topic train - vlak od Paříže = the train from Paris (direction) vlak z Paříže = the train from Paris (starting point of the train path)
Jana: This is a subtlety I have difficulty to grasp. Czech is far more precise than French or English.
The preposition "z" in the sense of direction, can be translated (roughly) as "outward from inside," where "od" means "away from." Hence, "vlak z Paříže" means the starting place for the train was somewhere inside Paris, whereas "vlak od Paříže" doesn't distinguish the starting place, but rather that the train is moving away from Paris. Basically these prepositions are the exact opposite of "do" (into) and "k" (toward). And yes, Czech is definitely more precise than English.
