I've been to Czechia 5 times, the last for 2 years. My son, who has been there for 7 years and visits for summers back in the US. We lived together and he warned me that coming home would be culture-shock in reverse. Living away from the States gives you a new perspective, mostly very bad, about American Culture. I can put up with pretty much everything wrong with America (and I don't include Canada here, a really great culture and people). It's now very depressing to me. But the one thing that just gnaws at my guts is the fifference in the children. One of the first things that struck me on my first visit to Czechia was how calm, polite, and little adult-like they were. My favorite past time was sitting in the park and watching the children. (Something a 57 year old man can't even do here without drawing suspicion.) The girls often looked like little Babickas. Fathers held their son's hand. Parents and other adults chatted with the children, letting them into the conversation. The extended family supports them and they are loved by many. On a family walk, the parents or grandparents let the children explore. The 3 times -- 3 times out of 2 years -- that I saw children getting out of hand, discipline can quick and firm. Czech children learn their boundaries and enjoy more inclusion. They don't whine in stores, they don't beg for toys. The children grow up to be happy, calm, laid-back adults. It is so sad. This is the way my Czech father treated me and how I treated my children. I don't understand why most of us Americans have children if they are going to treat them so badly. And these children grow up to take guns to school, become substance-abusing adults without parenting skills, become divisive, superficial, banal and citizens who vote for amoral, unethical business and government leaders, and -- voila -- a brutal foreign power. I used to be an apologist for the US. No more. My only friends here in the States are immigrants or my Czech friends. I would like to balance my rant with all the positive things that are here, and all the negative things about Czechia, but I've gone on too long. I'd welcome your comments, especially from Czechs who have emmigrated to the States. Thanks for listening to me.
I can't argue with you that American children are spoiled and ill treated. Most American parents throw material goods at their children instead of giving them time and attention. Many American parents are too busy and too tired to bother with discipline. The result is that we have spoiled, ungrateful, selfish children who grow up to think that everyone one owes them something and they don't have to work for anything. It's not the children's fault, but the fault lies in the cultural thinking that everyone is special (another way of saying no one is special), grading and competition is bad for self-esteem, and discipline hinders the child's opportunity to be self-expressive. However, I must say that we are still the best country in the world and I wouldn't give it up for anything. Many people continue to flock to this country because they know it is the best country in which to live. My husband (czech) and his czech immigrant friends came here for a reason and none of them want to go back; even though they also have some complaints about our country.
You can blame that one on Dr. Spock (or at least partially). I think your perspective on America is a little too narrow if you think the phrase "most Americans" applies to half of what you said. I'll agree that the U.S. is changing and more for the worse than the better, particularly in terms of social norms and family values, but it is unfair to label the average American adult as a doped-up dead-beat parent with undisciplined, whiny children, albeit certainly such exist here, as well as anywhere else. As for the brutal foreign power part, every nation in the world has their amoral unethical government (and business) leaders (elected or otherwise); the only difference is that the potential for abuse of power on a global scale is much higher when the country in question is a superpower, both economically and militarily. Now having said all this, I agree that there is definitely some truth in what you say, yet I believe that you are grossly exaggerating.
I agree with pretty much everything Sova said. However, I have trouble agreeing with the quoted part above. Although most American parents are not doped-up dead beats, MOST American parents lack true discipline in rearing their children. For the most part, children no longer have chores (or very few), children feel it is their right to talk back to their parents because they have a right to express themselves. Children are given almost everything they ask for. Walk into a public school anywhere in the country and speak with the teachers. They will tell you that MOST American children have too many material goods and their parents don't help them with homework or enforce respect. Most American parents don't communicate with the teachers on a regular basis, nor do they support the discipline policies of the school. Should a child get bad grades and be suspended from playing the next football or basketball game, many parents will argue with the coach. Should a child talk back in school and get detention, many parents will argue with the principal. I love my country. However, the state of families is quickly deteriorating and its a sad state of affairs. I can only pray that the generation growing up watching their peers be mouthy and disrespectful will do a better job rearing their own children than the current generation of parents. I don't know what it is like in other countries and perhaps the children are the same in every industrialized nation. Perhaps its the times and not the people.
I was raised in Europe myself... Germany for 10 years, and I grew up with different family values than most Americans. This is due to my parents parenting, yet Europe doesn't force a material culture down your throat. Sex is seen as something one does, but not a taboo, and violence in any form is questioned harshly... in America, sex is $$$ yet is banned from television, and violence is allowed all over our channels. We think it to be normal, but we are really backwards and don't realize it. Personally, I want to raise my future kids in Europe while they are young, and then let them reach maturity here in America with the good character they built overseas. It's what happened to me, and I appreciate the oppurtunity it's given me. It gives me values, and a perspective. Many Americans lack the later.
I just recently moved to college, and i live in a dorm room. I have, by czech standards, way too much clothing. But I must admit, I like clothing. However, I don't own that much. Especially when I can say that every girl in my dorm has at least 3 times as much as i do. And they tell me I'm crazy for having too little. However, I find that my life is so much more focused and clearer when I don't have clothing falling out of everything. ANd I have more money for the things I really love - like travelling and chocolate. My parents raised me this way, but living in Europe stopped me from changing my views when I moved out on my own. I have also come to dislike American Culture and Values, but what can we do??
What do you mean, "living in Europe stopped you from changing your views"? Did you grow up in Europe? I'm confused how living there stopped you from changing your views. I'm sorry you don't like our culture. We have many good qualities. I love American Culture and many of American values, especially traditional values. I just don't like how many parents are straying from traditional values and rearing their children to be spoiled and mouthy.
To tell you the truth....reading though my own post, I have no idea what I was saying. My only excuse is that it was midterms week (which means I didn't sleep very much and shouldn't have been online anyways) I *think* what I meant was that my parents did instill these values in me (like many other parents do for their own children) and I've noticed that a lot of children "lose" a lot of this knowledge when they move out on thier own (ie; frivolous spending on things they dont need). And the values? I meant the trend that Americans are following with concern to putting too much importance on material objects, and not on the important things - family, friends, good health, etc ...and I'm making a note to myself to say away from MBs when I haven't slept enough...even I had to read that a few times through to understand it! :wink:
Oh, ok, thanks for the clarification. I also wish American's would value family more than materialism.
I think its all in the way a culture values its children and youth. In the US a good education is bought and paid for, so are health services, shelter, career opportunities and business contacts. There are not many opportunities for a young person to shine without access to lots of money and the support of a cashed-up family. On the other hand in Europe if you have the talent the ability and the drive you can access a good education, get access to good health care and get a good job with good future prospects. This however is changing as Europe is Americanised. How do our governments value children??? How do they value A diverse Education and opportunities for ALL children and their families? What support systems are there for children, young people and families? I think the time and money we (our governments) spend on our children and youth dictates the social capital of our societies, communities and culture.
You have to be careful there. The more money the government spends on our children, the less control we as parents have over our children. If the government provides my health insurance, the government chooses the doctor I take my children to. I know I was once a single mother and my children were on medicaid, it's a horrible system. I think one of the greatest things the government has done in education is allow school of choice; at least in Michigan -- it's not in all states. We all know that competition will force people to improve the product. Now that schools are competing for students, the education has improved.
Question is, how about parents which don't care about their children education and health, because they are poor and uneducated themselves.
apathy toward your children is not caused by financial hardship and lack of education. Unfortunately there are parents who don't care about their children and abuse and neglect their children. There, the government must step in and do the job. But I'm talking about the trend that is slowing taking place in this country to allow the government to rear our children instead of us. The other night a politician was on TV saying that parents should have no say in what is taught in public schools. :shock: Parents pay taxes for the school, elect the board that runs the school, and send their own flesh and blood to the school. Yet they should have no say in what is taught. There is this horrid trend in our country to slowly take away the rights of parents and hand them over to the government. And most the time, power goes where the $$ are. Trust me, I'm not against putting money into children's programs. I've spent my entire adult life, and some teen years working in social work with children. But be careful allowing the government to do it. My vote goes for the private agencies. Allow prevention programs to run through private agencies, they will do a better job and still allow the parents to have control over their children.
I can't speak for observations of children Europe, but I can speak about my observations of children in the US. I grew up in the 80's and if I acted anything like many of the American children now I would have gotten back handed. Not beaten, just a bit of a swat on the butt or a tap on the mouth. I can't go grocery shopping without some unruly kid running around and run right into me. Does the mom or dad apologize? No. It seems that everyone is expected to think the neighbors kid is adorable no matter what and if you say anything to the parent on the contrary they get mad at you. How many Americans have seen "soccer moms" in their giant SUVs driving, ahem... swerving, down the road talking on cell phones while their unbuckled kids are in the backseat jumping around? On the issue of financial status of parents. Money has nothing to do with it. You don't have to be poor to be white trash. The hotel I work at is about 1/2 hour from a prison. Once in a great while we have people who come to our hotel who are visiting inmates. Some of the kids who are visiting dads in jail are unruly and bratty and have caused over $1,000 in damages. Other kids who visit dad are nice, cordial and polite. Many years ago Hillary RODHAM Clinton wrote a book called It takes a village to raise a child. Since when do I have to raise the village children. I thought it took a parent to raise a child. Even many of the politicians who support parent's choice and school choice have to show off the "happy ass" family in their ads and literature. I have gotten pamphlets in the mail with "Joe Schmoe the candidate" and here's this picture of the smiling candidate and his smiling wife and smiling kids. What are the first things he lists as his qualifications? He's been married for umpteen years, his wife is president of the Junior League (for non- Americans, it's some sort of club for rich women), Johnny plays - fill in boy's sports here, Suzy plays - fill in girls sports here. I don't give a rat's ass about his family life! In fact the more I see that the more I think he's a filandering dog! Sorry to get off track. I was just making a point about even politicians are getting in on this "ain't my kid cute' culture in America. Don't get me wrong, I like kids, I just believe it should be an adults world. If mom cooks meatloaf and brockoli then eat it or go to bed without dessert. Not mom and dad have meatloaf, Johnny has mac and cheese, Suzy has a hot dog, Janie has a happy meal..... That's all, gypzy
I agree with much of the above but let's not forget that parenting is not what it used to be. The strain of protecting children of all sorts of dangers unknown to the previous generations is stretching the parenting time thin. I'm talking of drugs, child predators, both online and in the street, brutal music, brutal movies, brutal computer games, easily accessible pornography, children snatched from their bedrooms and whatnot. You too would fix a special meal for Johnny because -- you never know -- tomorrow he could be a victim of a school shooting. That's America (and Canada) today, folks!
You're right, there is never security in tomorrow and the small amount of security we do have is slipping away with the perilous times. However, we can't lack discipline and go without rules due to fear that the child may not be alive tomorrow. Perhaps the child would then live into a ripe old age but never learn a lesson in life. Now, if you are simply saying, "pick your battles, given the times we should loosen up on a few things" then I agree with you. But if you are saying "spoil your kids because you don't know if they will be alive tomorrow", I must disagree.
That was my point exact. After all, in the time that it takes to go through McDonalds drive-thru and make special meals, mom can use that time to hug, kiss, play, read stories and etc. with her kids. Plus kids who are disciplined at the family table make better house guests and act better at restuarants. I don't know about other people but if I invite friends/relatives and thier kids to eat I'm not going to make a special meal for everyone. When I was a kid whoever had a birthday got to pick what to eat and everyone ate it, even if it was pizza with jelly-beans and tuna :mrgreen: ! It seemed more special when it was "me-day."
see, i have a different opinion. from what i notice, czech adults seem pretty mean and strict with their children..most of the time kids are crying or screaming and there parents just beat them or scare them. (well it even scares me..) czech kids/teens are however more independant and can go to/from school alone, or wherever..but some are really rude. especially the kids from ages 12-15. they do anything they want in the streets and swear at any passser by. they behave all tough and act like they own the streets. its not a comfortable feeling.
