czech eu presidency

Discussion in 'Miscellaneous (Czech-Related)' started by pedro1974, Dec 29, 2008.

  1. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

    Yep, this happened despite all of the states/colonies sharing a common language and ethnic background. Like you said, Europe doesn't have initial conditions as good as the USA did. For example, how does a government with 23 (and growing) official languages function?
  2. wer

    wer Well-Known Member

    Yes, that was the original intention. But even in the US there are obvious tendencies of the federal authorities to usurp more and more power despite of the constitution. Just remember the wars rejected by the Congress but enfored by the Government as “police actions”, or the famous Footnote Four. The case Wickard v. Filburn is possibly on the very top as for the absurdity. I wonder what Thomas Jefferson would think of it.

    Still, the US democracy prospers. In long term, there are some shifts in rules, but in short terms, the rules are stable and the Government varies in line with the will of the people.
    The situtation in the EU is different – the Government is stable and the rules vary in line with the needs of the Government. Could you imagine three different constitutions formulated by one single Government in the US? Things like these actually happen in the EU.

    This only means that the citizens are entitled to address to EU administrative in their language and that they must be answered in the same language. It also mean that all the laws of the union must be in all the languages, otherwise there are null and void (In reality, most of the law is not translated, there is for example no Czech translation of the founding treaties of the EC, so the basic law of the union should be null and void here).
    The Union is administered in English (for practical purposes), in French (to appease the French complexes) and in the official language(s) of the country in presidency (that happens to be Czech right now). There are some tendencies to replace the French with German, or at least to add the German (That’s the most common mother tongue in the EU), but France would resist this.
  3. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    Scrimshaw, Sova:

    You Americans are SO pesimistic! ;) ;)
  4. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    Wer, you are amazing, where do you come up with these, to me, obscure cases? I was not familiar with the particular cases.
    But yes, in times of urgency or necessity, it seems rules are sometimes bent or laxed. Depression era decisions is probably a very good example.

    And ''packing the court'' is feared by both political parties.
    As justices in the supreme court come up for retirement, the president is able to place candidates for justice in front of congress for confirmation to that office. If they are approved, those justices leanings will be felt for years.
    They are supposed to, and on the whole do, make decisions strictly according to the constitution, but their interpretation of the intent of the constitution is swayed by their private beliefs.

    Three different one country...cannot imagine that.
    Seems to me it would be a recipe for confusion.
  5. Sova

    Sova Well-Known Member

    I prefer to say "cautiously skeptical." :p
  6. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    Pessimistism....hmmmm...not sure if that's what I want to project here.
    I guess my comments have not been on the optimistic side regarding a successful attempt at forming a single country out of the different states of europe, it's just that I really do see a lot of hurdles.
    But, hope it turns out successful, whatever the union will look like when it is created. It seems to me that it is already well on it's way to reality.
  7. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    Of course, it would help if I spelled it right...Pessimism..
  8. Qcumber

    Qcumber Well-Known Member

    :lol: I wonder why some people always feel it necessary to drag in the French when they broach the problem of languages in the EU, and present them as obstinate people against progress.
    Have you forgotten France and Germany are among the founding states, and that their languages were used from the very beginning, and not in competition, but in complementarity along with all the other languages of the founding states?
    English started being used only once the UK had half-joined the EU ... and after a lot of begging and whining (if you remember), and the acceptance of the founding states.
    Now, in the whole world, the trend is to replace all languages by English. That it should happen in the EU administration and institutions is not surprising. I don't think many French and German citizens are worried about it because they know this will not mean the end of French in the francophone world, nor the end of German in the germanophone one. English is merely used as a dry international means of communication, but can't ever express the souls of Continental peoples.
  9. Ctyri koruny

    Ctyri koruny Well-Known Member

    I think English works quite well as an international language as it is the easiest (simplest) non-makey-upy (e.g. Ido, Esparanto) language in Europe.

    I don't think it's as reasonable to ask Spanish ministers to learn French or German as it is to ask them to learn something easier.

    So until Ido is compulsorily in all schools in Europe then English is the best option.

    But Ido is a ridiculous concept anyway.. because within 100 years a German person will be speaking a completely different Ido to a French person and we're back where we started.
  10. Qcumber

    Qcumber Well-Known Member

    Non-English speaking politicians seldom speak good English. In the EU administration and institutions communication from one language to another is insured by batteries of official translators and interpreters.
    As regards the evolution of languages, no doubt next century's English will be different from today's English, and this is true whatever the language considered.
  11. Qcumber

    Qcumber Well-Known Member

    What is Ido?
  12. Alexx

    Alexx Well-Known Member

    Artificial language of some kind.

    About Ido in Ido:

    Ido esas internaciona linguo kun poka polisemio sate konciza kreita da Louis de Beaufront en 1907 kom Esperanto reformita, adoptita internacione en Paris ye oktobro 1907, kom “idiomo helpanta internaciona”, da la Delegitaro (Délégation pour l’adoption d’une langue auxiliaire internationale).

    From artifical languages I like "slovio" the most, I guess it is pretty good, I am by myself able to read almost everything in it, try it (sx = š, cx = č):

    Sxto es Slovio? Slovio es novju mezxunarodju jazika ktor razumijut cxtirsto milion ludis na celoju zemla. Slovio mozxete upotrebit dla gvorenie so cxtirsto milion slavju Ludis ot Praga do Vladivostok; ot Sankt Peterburg cxerez Varsxava do Varna; ot Sredzemju Morie i ot Severju Morie do Tihju Okean. Slovio imajt prostju, logikju gramatia i Slovio es idealju jazika dla dnesju ludis. Ucxijte Slovio tper!

    However, I do not believe in artificial languages, there is always going to be some leading language in the world, as was Latin, French, Spanish and now English. Most of those people who are speaking this language will never be into learning some other, artificial, language. No ofense. I see something similar on my self - if I am able to read slovio, why would I learn it???
  13. Qcumber

    Qcumber Well-Known Member

    Thanks a lot Alexx.
    All these artificial languages are interesting, but I don't think many people would bother learning any.
    Incidentally I saw once a pan-Latin language for all Romance language speakers (French, Italian, Portuguese, Romanian, Spanish [alphabetical order]). I could understand the test page without much effort, but the same could be said about Spanish. I have never studied Spanish, but can understand a lot of it in a magazine. On the other hand, would people understand one another if they spoke these artificial languages? Nothing is more uncertain.
  14. Ctyri koruny

    Ctyri koruny Well-Known Member

    I understood some of that .. it's some kind of pan-slavik language?

    I think maybe everyone should learn panjabi.. as again it's something most people can understand.. there was an English man on the television before who spoke it and when he went to France he tried to speak the French he learnt in school to them and no one understood him.. so he spoke panjabi (his mother tongue) to them and they understood fine!

    I think that although it is quite democratic and unfair.. you need the universal language to be something that at least some people speak as a first language. .because you need some kind of rules to stop it from evolving differently within every nation it is spoken.
  15. Alexx

    Alexx Well-Known Member

    Yes, quite modern actually.

    What I understand from it - czech word by word so you can compare:

    Co je Slovio? Slovio je nový mezinárodní jazyk kterému rozumí čtyřista miliónů lidí na celém světě. Slovio můžete použít pro komunikaci se čtyřista milióny slovany od Prahy po Vladivostok; od Sankt-Peterburgu přez Varšavu do Varny, od Středozemního moře a od Severního moře k Tichému Oceánu. Slovio má jednoduchou, logickou gramatiku a Slovio je iddeální jazyk pro dnešní lidi. Učte se Slovio!

    The concept is very simple, it uses words common for all or most slavic languages, very simple grammar (which is very similar in all slavic languages anyway).
  16. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    What ever became of that Esperanto language? Don't hear about it anymore.

    I had never heard of Ido before. Four million people, are they exaggerating?
  17. Qcumber

    Qcumber Well-Known Member

    :lol: Who would believe such a stupid version of the story? :lol:
    In the original, a Pakistani has just landed in London, and nobody understand his English, so he switches to Pakistani, and everybody understands him.

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