What is it that intrigues foreigners about CZ women?

Discussion in 'Culture' started by caulfield2, Oct 10, 2006.

  1. Natureboy

    Natureboy Active Member

    Yikes, my friend, that's all I can say to that website.

    'Drama of the gifted only child', an abused one no less, the model scene at that level of emotional development-- sorta has danger written all over it--

    I think sometimes little girls need boundaries, and perhaps it is not our job to provide them. One could end up a dormat to her adulthood, and then left to wallow in her muck!

    Will difinitely be adjusting my parameters to the "over 30" category, It's one thing to be a daddy to kids, but not to a spouse.

    I am sorry you got trapped in this, but what a trap...
    Glad to hear you got out of that one alive!!
  2. caulfield2

    caulfield2 Well-Known Member

    I'm 12 years older than her.

    So I sort of "morphed" into her father, because I taught her everything she needed to know (plus I'm a teacher for a career)...of course, the danger in that type of situation is that it's a no-win. If you try to control someone that needs to be free (having never had freedom under her fatgher's roof), then you cause them to run away. If you don't try to control them, you're being soft and letting them run all over you. No matter what you do, it's impossible. She simply wasn't ready to be married and my ego told me I could make almost anything work...or, that if you just love someone enough, it will work out. You can't love someone "more," you can't convince them they should love you. All you do is smother them and make them feel unworthy and trapped if they can't reciprocate the very same emotion.

    It was a great learning experience, I don't regret it in the least, and I learned a lot about myself as a person and some of the bad "bachelor" habits I'd become accustomed to. It was actually quite invaluable, and, if I ever get married again, I will already know my weaknesses and be better able to compensate for them. Financially, it hasn't been that big of a deal. I haven't lost anything on that side, like many. In fact, she would feel guilty if she ended up with any of my money I think.

    There are plenty of women that are 25-35 that are more suitable, especially the ones with kids, a job, an education, a car, an independent existence not relying upon their family. Of course, women with those things MIGHT be less likely to be interested in a foreigner.

    Many men threw themselves at Irina, tried to impress her with their money and cars and houses (it's very common to make women mistresses in Russia and "take care of them" financially for married men)...but I give her credit for having the integrity to pick a "middle class" teacher with an "average" house.
  3. Natureboy

    Natureboy Active Member

    Double yikes brother--

    If I read between the lines here one could get the feeling this is a sort of scam, a con that is perhaps prevalent? Boy am I glad I missed out on that one!

    What do our Czech friends have to say about this? Are all many of the most beautiful women there gigling in shame for being part of a syndicate to con American men of means, or are they rising up in irritated opposition to assure us that beautiful young women are not all corrupt selfish criminal witches?

    As to the question of discipline and temper, don't they have dog trainers who do that?? Sounds like Haldol is in order here...

    In all seriusness, the moment of the opening of the blossom of feminine beauty is an amazing one (for photographs), but it is ephemeral and short lived-- unfortunately this culture markets that like a bunch of closet pedophiles, completely corrupting the "barely legal" themselves before dumping them in a heap of anorxic drug-addicted has-beens a few years later--

    The hyped up element of beautiful young women, their conversion to a sort of commodity, it's like a major complex all the way around, leaves nobody happy nor satisfied except the sleazy fashionistas and pornographers who abuse themselves, their public and their models with this obsessive marketing of fresh pubescence.

    Again I am sorry you got hooked into this, you are admirable for staying cool. One does not envy the inevitable heartbreak of this situation.
  4. caulfield2

    caulfield2 Well-Known Member

    I think we made a mistake, we didn't know each other well enough to get married.

    Partly, this is due to the way visas work in the US, especially since 9/11. It would have taken 18 months to come here if I wouldn't have married her, because of the area of the US where I live. In Vermont, for instance, only 3-4 months. This is what's called a K-1 or spousal visa, where you have 90 days to get married or the foreigner must return to their country. That would have been the better way to do it, but I didn't want to wait.

    There are tons of stories that are far worse. Financial ruin, children without two parents, abuse, violence, murder...to tell you the truth, there are just as many women who are victimized as men, probably more.

    The fact of the matter is that 50% of marriages are doomed to failure, so that might be a scam in general, right? At least in this day and age. And a higher number of domestic marriages than international ones end in divorce. If I would have married someone closer to my age, maybe with kids, and if we would have known each other for more than 3 weeks together (talking, e-mailing, IMing every day for 6 months is not the same...it actually creates the illusion you know someone) in "reality," things probably would have worked out.

    My mistake, the mistake of MANY men, is falling in love with the beauty, perhaps the youth. Irina had five years of university and spoke nearly fluent English, so it's not as if she was a naive, provincial farm girl that I took advantage of....but consider the other side, leaving your family, friends, pets, culture, customs, food, religion...and putting your entire faith in one person. That's a huge risk for both sides, isn't it?

    Luckily, we're both good enough people that neither one of us was severely hurt by this situation. I still remain optimistic about life, love and the future. It's just the way I'm built.
  5. Natureboy

    Natureboy Active Member

    I just so hate these break-ups, people putting their hopes and faith in each other, trashing all that over perhaps fictional dissatisfactions--

    Even worse is even the thought of a life of endless fast flings.

    I think you had a beautiful magical fairytale story, I wish it could have worked, if only just to prove me wrong about modern love...
  6. Natureboy

    Natureboy Active Member

    But what's so bad about seducing naiive provincial farm-girls anyway? :p
  7. caulfield2

    caulfield2 Well-Known Member

    I probably dated, if that's what you want to call it, 50-60 different women last year in Colombia.

    It was great fun, but, no, not satisfying over the long run. I just had to get it out of my system, but am patiently waiting for the "one" to reappear or appear.
  8. alenastef

    alenastef Well-Known Member

    60 in one year??? You are quite a busy man!

    Anyway, the fact is that beautiful women have very easier life. I have seen many cases... even university is a soft experience if she is nice. It is not their fault, the world is like this. We others have to work hard and seduce with our brains. Huh.... :?
  9. Rommie

    Rommie Well-Known Member

    Are you kidding me?! Easier life? I can tell you something about university, baby. It´s really soft experience when a techer kick you out of the exam cause he wants to see you again and get into your pants. It´s experience when he calls you on your cell phone, bothers you and wants you to join him on his business trip. It´s great when you got the worst mark for test cause he wants you to have in his office for a little talk. It´s AWESOME when teacher is a Woman who hates another women - especially the beautiful ones.
    Then no matter how you need for example scholarship, cause your marks will never be good enough because of that freaks.
    When you´re nice and kind, they think they an use you and abuse you.
    When you don´t play that game, you´re a nasty b***.
    Is that fair?

    And for "scam" and "con" - not all the women are interested in Americans or wealthy guys. Please, no generalizations.
  10. caulfield2

    caulfield2 Well-Known Member

    Interesting rommie.

    Irina had similar experiences in Russia. Only bad mark was from an older, female teacher. Bribes were given to guarantee grades, especially for lesser students.

    She was lucky to get into the most prestigious university and not have to pay much due to her test scores and grades before that.

    Lots of women like her lose their position because 1) they don't come from the right family, politics (another friend lost a very prestigious scholarship because the father of the winner was politically-connected AND 2) they refuse to sleep with anyone or participate in such a charade.

    Most "assistants" or "secretaries" in Russia are expected to sleep with their male bosses, especially the young and attractive ones. It's a given, some even spell it out more clearly in the announcements..."need someone to accompany on business trips" or words to that affect.

    Also common that politicians and rich men (usually married) would try to make offers for her to be their mistress and be taken care of, have her own apartment, car, jewelry, credit cards, clothing alllowance. This is still quite common with the former Russian mafia, organized crime syndicate guys who want to have their "cake and eat it too."
  11. Rommie

    Rommie Well-Known Member

    Now I wanna see what you consider in it to be so easy?

    I´ve met a guy last year, an old one, and he told me "You are such a pretty girl. Do you know you will have to sleep with your boss if you wanna be succesful?"
    He didn´t care I study and I´m good in it. Cause here in Czech, I´ll always have a boss. A male boss. And it´s soo "clear" I´ll sleep with him. Cause I´m pretty in his opinion. And ambitious.

    Thanks God our studies aoe not fixed on politics.
  12. Natureboy

    Natureboy Active Member

    So having done that, (Mr. Wilt Chamberlain of Columbia...) I am curious:

    Why, if one girl is fun, does one then look for the next? Why only such a short time with each, is there only one night of fun, after that it's boring??

    Do you not feel that you leave a piece of your heart with each one, having shared intimacy?

    In the end do massive multiple affairs drain or enhance?

    All those 'quick showers with raincoat on', is that really fun, if you know no trust and history to avoid std's?

    Are these females as eager to move on so fast as were you, did you mourn the loss of any of them?

    Is there a fundamental genetic difference between people who pursue sex as an addictive narcotic, and those who seek to share true love, and are the sex-addicts predestined to prevail for some evolutionary/proliferation reason?

    Do women secretly seek this, or is there any truth to the romantic notion that women are less promiscuous biologically by nature?

    Did anyof these women stalk you later, in jealousy and rage for lack of commitment?

    Were any of these women paid for their time and talents?

    Do not these women, or yourself worry bout putting so much mileage on your equipment that it will one day not be 'fun' any more??

    Are Columbian women more promiscuous and shallow in their relationship goals than other women, is this a latin thing?
  13. caulfield2

    caulfield2 Well-Known Member

    First of all, I hadn't had sex, AT ALL, for 18 months before I moved down there.

    I had probably had 1 one-night stand my entire life before moving down there.

    Believe me, there are hundreds of American men who "waited for marriage" to have sex with their future bride (foreign or otherwise) while she was having sex with her boyfriend (in her own country while waiting for you) and the funny part is that lots of men send money to women they don't even know in these situations....heck, half the time, they send money before they've even met. And a ton of men are "keyboard romeos" and never even get the courage to leave their country and travel to meet someone, paralyzed by the negatives of what might happen and spooked by conspiracy theories that they will be taken advantage of, kidnapped, murdered, etc.

    I had two girlfriends over that time that I very much liked and that I spent months with...but they were too young for me, and I was already married to a young woman and didn't want to go down that road again.

    There wasn't anyone I clicked with, partly because of the communication barriers (which are difficult to overcome), the cultural differences and the lack of emphasis on higher education prevalent in South American culture. It's slowly changing, but it's a process. I had fun, I spent money on plenty of dates and had a great time and I hurt one person, who was my serious girlfriend. And this was after we'd broken up already.

    And I didn't say I had sex with all of those women, that would be wrong to characterize it that way.

    It's just that you don't say you are boyfriend or girlfriend (te quiero) in Latin America until you are exclusively committed. If you go out with a woman 2-3 times but it doesn't progress, well, you'd have to say, by definition that you were dating...I don't know, I just got tired of trying to figure our motivations and who was really interested in me (for myself) and not my money and not my citizenship, so I returned to reality, so to speak.
  14. Natureboy

    Natureboy Active Member

    OK I've referenced some of these bride scams from the East--


    I can't decide who is more culpable, the hooker/scammer, or the fool who believes a letter from someone with a professional head shot complete with lighting and makeup and wardrobe--

    Either way, to prey on people's emotions in this professional way is a major crime-- I am dumbfounded it is so prevalent--

    I don't suppose you're going to tell me these girls are all the victims of child slavery? I would think these individuals are making their own choices, and as such are criminals--

    Perhaps there is a use for purges after all, Interpol should go through the countryside and dragnet each and every one of these sheisters, put them on trial, and haul them off to siberia until their bloom of abusive youth is shriveled and grey-- (or at least till they are 26, which ever comes first).

    While they are at it, they should round up every last remaining antisemite in the entire continent and put them to work maintaining holocaust museums, naked, in winter.

    I honestly don't know what is wrong with Europeans in general, it's not like these girls are impoverished, they're just criminals, gangsters in fact.
    As bad as any predator the internet ever gave rise to.

    It just makes no sense to me, Russian devotion to their Czar/Serf dynamic for centuries, only to kill the Czar to get Stalin, drink their way through the largest industrial, radioactive. polluting monstrosity ever created, only to hurl themselves at the emergency in Czernobyl out of patriotism, only to eventually throw the whole blood-soaked government out the window--

    And after all the purges, the revolutions, the 23 millions dead in ww2, all russia can come up with is a bunch of caviar trafficking gangsters and a hoard of prepuscent international extortionist hookers--

    I liked it better when to be socialist was progressive (illusion as that was-- these peoples were never going to cooperate!). These days supporting anything Russion or East in any way seems like cavorting with a bunch of drunken, horribly rascist gangsters, hookers and thugs--

    How can the once proud Russians be tolerant of what they've made of themselves and their national reputation?

    Perhaps East Europe can only exist under iron-fisted authoritarian rule, perhaps they are so used to oligarchy that freedom at all just means the freedom to be a sleazy, vodka swilling, perverted, murderous lying thugs. Please teel me it's better in Czech...

    What ever happened to the Ballet Ruse, the Constructivists, Dostoyevsky, St. Basel's, and all the greatest of Russian achievements???

    It seems the great and strong spirit of Russia just sort of backfired on itself-- what a pathetic bunch of sleazy alchoholics-- I say throw 'em in the brig!!

    Yikers in deed-- I hate sleazy, racist gangsters and criminals, these people all need some serious limits-- not a developed enough mentality for democracy-- bring back the Czar-- I'd rather look at him and his
    pretty family at picnics then look at what Russia ultimately turned into!

    One could get very bitter about people indeed seeing how all of the national struggles ultimately turned out-- but perhaps it's better to know that the human species is generally horrible to its core, that love, compassion do not really exist, and it's all about war greed and sleaze.

    Some Brave Neo World-- it's worse than Orwell or Huxley could have ever imagined!

    (I still really want to see St. Basel's in real life....)
  15. Natureboy

    Natureboy Active Member

    Correct me if I'm wrong:

    Looking for love in the East block is like wandering into the movie "Derailed"-- and unless you're willing to be Clive Owen and murder them all, one would do well just to stay away--

    Is it just a bad, sleazy culture in general? Is this a decadent Catholic thing??
  16. caulfield2

    caulfield2 Well-Known Member

    St. Basil's is beautiful.

    You're forgetting a couple of things...the US had the chance to bail out Russia in 1997 and 98 and we refused to do so.

    The IMF, World Bank and Treasury Department bailed out Mexico, Brazil and a number of Asian countries in the 90's, but we left Russia to fall apart.

    If you lived in a country where your currency had been devalued to nothing twice in a generation, would you believe in saving again? Don't you see how almost everyone wants to get rich quick, before the money's all gone?

    The best thing in the world would be if every economy in the world was equal and men and women had equal earnings potential and every person had the same amount of money!!! Then money and status would not be a part of a relationship, or any material considerations.


    Whenever there are the vast inequalities you see, there is great potential for illegal activity. Ask the Czechs on the board where many of the prostitutes in their country come from...it's the former Russian republics, Ukraine especially.

    However, these girls are often duped into leaving their countries by criminal enterprises and sleazeballs (who promise legit jobs) who end up seizing their passports and selling these women into forced slavery until they're used up and discarded....many commit suicide, try to escape, are physically and mentally abused. They're lucky to ever return home again.

    One of the worst offenders in terms of the sex trade is Israel...especially by per capita population. Italy, Germany, Spain, the US, are bad, but not even close to Israel, and Thailand and some of the other Asian countries like Malaysia and Indonesia.

    You can also blame it on Yeltsin and his "shares for loans" to the richest 15 oligarchs in the country that set Russia back another 50 years.

    It's no wonder we see and hear about all these scams and desperate motivations to find a land of brighter opportunities and better living conditions.
  17. Natureboy

    Natureboy Active Member

    "One of the worst offenders in terms of the sex trade is Israel..."

    This I definitely did not know... in what way, who is selling what to whom?? Isrealis. and Jeweish girls in general are quite insane as a culture (not to generalize of course), and you have to really like dramatic, nutty military fanatics to hang with Isrealis (and that's from the supposedly Jewish perspective...)

    I entirely agree the world wealth belongs to the world-- despite addictive mentality. But for sure the vast lion's share of wealth should be redistributed-- Will I be 'Wellstoned' or blacklisted for saying that?? The greatest of national crimes is to corner all the wealth while poverty prevails for the vast majority--

    but are these people really impoverished in Ukraine (the former "breadbasket of Europe, I hear a beautiful and pastoral place)? Is there any comparison to Bangeladesh, or are these people just a bunch of selfish hores looking to exploit American's bizarre infatuation with blondness for the pursuit of ill-gotten wealth??

    I have primitive farm impliments from many places, beatiful butter churns and pitch-forks from Ukraine. There was a time, not at all long ago, even here, when people had a different sort of work ethic, and worked their farms, and lived humble, wholesome lives. Does this get-rich-quick/take it all before someone else does ethic really satisfy? I think not. And it all came at the expense of a wonderfully humanistic hard-working humble culture, generally speaking.

    (Besides, I would so prefer to see the proverbial 'Irina' in her bonnet churning butter and milking cows then posing in a studio maliciously hooking men for their assets-- and I'm certain she would be a better person for it...)

    Perhaps the only way for people to count their blessings is to put the fear of god into them.

    As for me, I think I'll stay here on the farm for a while yet... the squirrels and deer aren't trying to scam me my assets at least! There is nothing wrong with a culture of artisans who trade, commerce on an organic level-- but this instant-gratification scenario created by American marketing, this I think is what corrupted a formerly peacful and agrarian culture--

    Maybe there is a place for the blissfuly humble (whether they survive selling baubles to rich people or not is another story... but I am living proof it is entirely possible to be quite well off without marketing and manipulating through sex-laden, manipulative advertising, etc.)

    These times are as disasterous as any, for we, as a species, appear to truly have lost our souls, there is not much left to love about this species, I find--

    I just hate the side of people that is selfish, manipulative, greedy, ungrateful and divisive. The general landscape of the human heart is a barren, greedy, miserable place-- all of our new utopian tools did not bring about Utopia, rather just more tricks to swindle, scam and abuse-- What a very bad species to the core--

    Ain't easy being the last human alive... Perhaps here and there, holed up in the woods exists others with integrity-- just may need to move to the midwest to find them!
  18. BMoody

    BMoody Well-Known Member

    If my Czech girlfriend is gold digging, then she is doing a good job! Not of spending my money, but of hooking me to then spend my money, lol. Goodness, I'm positive now that I love that girl. That means it's about hopeless now, right? lol

    *I know, I know... Czechs are at the center of Europe and a lot different. I just think it's funny to poke fun at.*

    BTW- I was talking with her the other day, and I guess she is 1/8th Ukranian and she hates to admit it. I pointed out that "if we have kids, our kids will be 1/16th Ukr@#$%@#%@!!!" she covered my mouth and scolded me to never ever say that! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Her grandfather on her father's side is Ukranian and I guess he isn't the pick of the litter. She is a bit prejudice I guess.
  19. caulfield2

    caulfield2 Well-Known Member

    Ah, yes...I remember well (when I used to post at the rwguide.com message boards) all the men who were so proud their girlfriends/wives/fiances never asked for money.

    I don't know if it's any indicator. I spent a pretty good amount of money on her, because it made me happy to do so. Nobody was going to tell me to "cut her off" or give her a very bare minimum so that she wouldn't become reliant upon me.

    The majority of the money I sent her was for things she really needed, English classes....an international driving class....a new winter coat. I probably subsidized her parents a little, but her dad (albeit a doctor) was unemployed for a long time.

    Ukrainians like to drink and gamble, I can tell you that much.

    Now men that send money Western Union to someone they've never met or send so much money per month their woman doesn't have to work at all, that's just setting yourself up for trouble. And, of course, there are many women that have 2-3-4 men sending them money at the same time, leading them on, while they have a nice spending allowance for their "real" boyfriend, who is probably in the military or another low-paying profession and unable to take care of her.
  20. Rommie

    Rommie Well-Known Member

    I can tell you - I worked in a center for victims of domestic violance , abusing and maltreated people and you really should know what MEN could do to their women!
    Yeah, there are women - how you called that? gold-digging?- yes, but it´s not a matter of where were you born!
    If Hollywood is a display window of America, you´ve got a lot of women like that, American women.
    And what about men , drinking, gambling, using their wifes, maltreating them. It´s okay? And it´s not just an issue in the Western part of the world.

    Btw. have you ever thought that ALL Americans except Americans Indians, are immigrants? You all are, with your true American women, immigrants from ALL parts of Europe. 8) You´ve got all the bad DNA as we do :!:

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