Dependent nouns

Discussion in 'Grammar & Pronunciation' started by Calvario, Oct 31, 2006.

  1. Calvario

    Calvario Well-Known Member

    I came across this rule in my study book.

    A dependent noun always stands in the genitive:
    Je tady málo místa .
    There isn't much room here.

    Mám knihu.
    I have a book.

    Mám mnoho knih
    I have many books.

    Más knihu?
    Más mnoho knih?

    MY question is are the above sentences correct? If not and a dependent noun stands in the genitive then why not?

    Also. If we say "How much of that do you have"
    Would it be " Kolik to(toho) más?
    If we are speaking about a previously mentioned noun that was feminine would we then use the ta or ten if it were masculine. Using the neuter seems a general reference like "I did that or I like that". It is redundant to repeat the noun over and over so we use "it" "that". I suspect we stick with the genger of the noun previously mentioned but I want to be sure.

    Thanks,
    Calvario
     
  2. alenastef

    alenastef Well-Known Member

  3. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    All these sequences are correct. (Más is correctly Máš, but I suppose it's because your keyboard.)

    Kolik toho máš is correct.

    If you want to keep grammatical gender:

    singular
    (M) Mám papír - Kolik ho máš?
    (F) Mám vodu - Kolik jí máš?
    (N) Mám maso - Kolik ho máš?

    plural
    (M) Mám papíry - Kolik jich máš?
    (F) Mám květiny - Kolik jich máš?
    (N)Mám zvířata - Kolik jich máš?
     
  4. eso

    eso Well-Known Member

    alenastef was faster :)
     
  5. wer

    wer Well-Known Member

    In this case it was correct. But I can't confirm it in general without knowing what means your "a dependent noun".
     
  6. Calvario

    Calvario Well-Known Member

    I think I got the answer to my question but I would like to clarify by example. Here goes.

    If I speak about something the happens to be a feminine noun and I later refer back to the same noun as "it" "this" or "that" do I have to use the feminine of "ten" or do I now refer to this item with "to".

    I have a book. I love IT. IT is great. You should read IT. I have read THIS many times. THIS is good reading.

    All the "IT" and "THIS" refer back to the book. So are they in the feminine because the word in Czech is F. or do we refer back to the book using the neuter. Is there a concrete rule in refering back to something. I suspect there is and I hate to beat this question into ground but I want to know for sure.

    Thanks,
    Calvario
     
  7. alenastef

    alenastef Well-Known Member

  8. MK

    MK Well-Known Member

    I think literal translation helps you more:
    Mám knihu.
    Miluji ji. <=> Miluji (tu) knihu.
    Je úžásná. <=> (Ta) kniha je úžasná.
    Měl by sis ji přečíst. <=> Měl by sis tu knihu přečíst.
    Mnohokrát jsem ji přečetl. <=> Mnohokrát jsem tu knihu přečetl
    Je to úžasné počtení. <=> Čtení (této) knihy je úžasné počtení. (sounds weird: "Reading of this book is goog reading" :shock:, in this sentence you are referring to "reading" not "book" )

    tu knihu/ta kniha ... ~ this book
     
  9. Zeisig

    Zeisig Well-Known Member

    I disagree. Confront with the following:

    Mám psa (masc. anim.).
    Mám ho rád. (ho = psa)
    Dávám mu kosti. (mu = psovi)
    Je to skvělý hlídač. (here you refer to hlídač which is neuter :?: ) Surely not, there are no neuter nouns at all. The pronoun "to" is formally a general subject of the sentence, not referring to anything.
     
  10. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    To can never be considered a neuter pronoun?
    Jana helped me with this about a month ago.

    Auto, neuter, as an accusative pronoun would be je, right?
    Kdo sedí v autě? Sedí v je.kamaradka.

    But???
    As a nominative pronoun?
    Auto je rychle.
    To je rychle?
     
  11. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    Wait, I got that wrong.

    Accusative pronoun for neutter noun.

    Vidíš auto?
    Ano, vidím je.
     
  12. MK

    MK Well-Known Member

    You are right. It was bad example. In this sentence is "to" a general subject which is neuter.

    So, "this":

    Ta je úžasná. (She)
    Ten je úžasný. (He)
    To je úžasné. (It)


    => To je úžasné počtení. (Is "to" general subject or replacement of "čtení" ?)
    => Ten je skvělý hlídač.
     
  13. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    It is my understanding that ´´to´´ is the nominative pronoun of neuter nouns

    To auto je ryclější než moje.

    AND...

    A generalized ´´it´´ for an unknown subject.

    To nerozumím.===So unspecific a subject that a gender can not be applied to it.
     
  14. MK

    MK Well-Known Member

    Exactly.

    Small corrections:
    To auto je rychlejší než moje.
    Tomu nerozumím.
     
  15. scrimshaw

    scrimshaw Well-Known Member

    Máš pravdu. Tomu nerozumím.

    Nerozumím občas ničemu, tak jsem rád, že to alespon chapu. :D
     

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